Katherine's Response

1. Catullus sees beauty physically. Looks matter the most when he’s judging the two girls. He is shallow in judging the two when he says there is “no spice” in Quintia, while “summing up” all that constitutes for Lesbia’s beauty. Inner beauty is not taken into account.

2.

In #33 Catullus open suggests to his Ipsitilla to get ready for his arrival home so that they can have sex. Again this shows Catullus’s bluntness when he speaks about women. He is in charge and holds the power. In my opinion he is insensitive. In #41 Catullus speaks of a prostitute with whom he’s had an encounter with. She is ugly and crazy in his eyes. Catullus does not feel bad for this prostitute who seems to be sick and needs some kind of medical attention. He simply rambles off about how ugly she is. In #43 Catullus is once again insensitive to a woman. She’s ugly to him because she isn’t beautiful physically. He still sees outer beauty instead of inner, and compares all women to Lesbia – the most beautiful woman to him, instead of seeing the good in every person individually.

Yes, his social commentary is valuable for modern times. In reality people have not advanced as much as we think. Men still think that they’re in control of women in their love lives and expect to get some when they get home. If you aren’t beautiful on the outside its hard for someone to fall in love with you because of all the shallow men out there like Catullus. However physical attraction does have a lot to do with a relationship.

3. You need to love yourself, discover yourself before you can ever be with another.It's about being comfortable in your own skin before falling for some one else. Romantic love is selfless. It is being yourself no matter what and allowing the other person to be who they are. It's about trust and respect before love really comes into play.

Elias Hussen: Catullus' View of Love and More

(1)
Catullus says about Quintia that she is "scarcely venereous" and that he basically disagrees with others who think of Quintia as "stunning". Further, he describes Lesbia as the one that fits the "Stunning" definition, having a total beauty. Catullus here is saying that a woman to be stunning, must not just be tall and have a pretty skin, but have more qualities. It seems from his words that he is seeking a women be perfect in all of her features. He is countering the traditional thinking at the time that a women who is tall and have a fair complexion is considered as beautiful. He is basically raising the the standard for women to be considered "Stunning".

(2)

Poem 27:
Catullus here basically talks about how he loves pure wine and none of it being watered down. This is shown in the poem when he calls on the servant to pour him the bitter wine and when he wishes for the water to get away from him and go to the conservatives who are not fond of getting drunk. Catullus also mentions how he likes to party and get drunk by referencing the "party-poopers" who might be interested in a weaker wine that is watered-down. This poem is not at all conservative. The negative reference to the party-poopers and his love for a bitter wine that is not watered-down are examples of how liberal his poems can be.

Poem 80:
The main theme of this poem revolves around oral sex. Catullus writes this poem as a conversation that he is having with a woman named Gellius and he asks her questions about rumors that say that she commits oral sex on men. He attributes the whiteness of her lips in the morning, as an effect of her committing of this act on men. The fact that Catullus was able to write such a poem at those times is very surprising to me. If he wrote such a poem today, I don't think he would get a lot of admiration for it; rather he would probably be condemned by a number of conservative media personalities and be known for his vulgar poems even though he writes other poems considered as proper.

Poem 83:
Catullus here talks about his lover Lesbia, who is obviously married to another man. It appears from the poem that Lesbia and Catullus have been separated and that Lesbia is now with another man. Catullus says that even though Lesbia talks bad about him in front of her man, she is still in love with him and that she is unable to forget about him. This can apply in modern times as we go through bad breakups or uneven love between couples that resulted in early breakups. What results is one slandering another in their social circles.

(3)
My definition of romantic love can be summed up with one word for our times - Tolerance. I think if two people are able to tolerate one another after a few weeks, months or years of staying together then there is romance. These days, as women are more independent, and both sexes dealing with so many social, financial and other issues, it gets very difficult to deal with the baggage that comes with a person. So, relationships often begin to fade when we learn more about the other person. So, it takes a lot of love of that person to be able to ignore her/his baggage and choose to be with her/him.

Ira Cabrele - Romantic Love

3. Actually when thinking of romantic love..i thought about the movie "Love story" and the note that is on the cover of the cd" Love means never having to say you'are sorry". Probably this happens only in movies and not in real life, but it would be too beautiful to be in love and never hurt or do something to your beloved one that you have to feel sorry about!
Romantic love is about powerful non irational feelings. It is about reciprocal respect and trust. It is about enjoying every second and moment with your beloved. Enjoying a sunset, enjoying clouds moving slowly into the sky.
In romantic love nothing looks impossible. You feel powerful like you have the whole universe in your hands. You feel that you have to do everything to please your love. Sometimes romantic lovers do not even care of their own lifes. Look for example at Anna Karenina, or Romeo and Juliet.
Unfortunately, real romance no longer exists in our days... Eveything is just too much available out there. Men no longer feel the necessity of courting a woman, write a beautiful love letter or other small things such as opening the door of a car or make sacrifices to please the beloved one... If we find someone that is romantic we just look at them like their are martians. It seems to me that the romance is an extinguishing specie even though I want to be optimistic and still believe in it.

Answers to the question

1. I think Catullus gave us a slightly different way to define "how a beauty woman is" as we now do.
everybody do look through everything which is apparent, just like what Catullus described on Quintia's attractive: how tall she is or how the she looks like in particular part. But further more, he puts his" sexy formula " into his vision of love and beauty. As a man to judge a women not only by what he see, but also look insight that any phychological feeling and physical arouses that he could write down, makes the beauty woman more tasty.

2 #32 (i have to say most impressive maybe) Catullus showed us how a "naked" love could be. Without any additional word to cover his sexual urge, this could be the most effective way to show sexual needs. "My prick is poking through my cloak and tunic" which the last sentence in the paragraph best illustrate how Catullus himself is strongly thoughts of making love for the whole day.

#52 Catullus show us how jealous he could be when someone he don't like( or just he looks ugly) meets anything good. "Nonius, the growth, sits in the curule chair" . Catullus uses the simplest word to release his anger when he gets to know"such unfavourable man could be a success." so he talked to himself,"What's happening, Catullus? Why do you wait to die?" to show his most inside part emotion

#58 In this part , Catullus showed us some irony part of his poem, first part he described his best love for Lesbia "more than himself and more than all his own" but he then found out that his lover "toss-off the grandsons of the brave Remus in the street" compare to others that Catullus hates, he didn't uses any strong language on her action.


3 My personal definition of romantic love, it could be very simple: you and your lover is just as a whole. whenever you two are together, both of you are going to make it better for you to get closer in physical or mental . a good date could be a nice side dish, but the important part would be how you interact with your partner, and find out how close you two could reach. If that's the true romantic, you would feel smooth for everything you two have done, have sacrificed, have worked out and have experienced.

1. Based on what I have read, Catullus mathematically compares the two women to each other. He gets into a “rational” definition of beauty which involved curves and the search for perfection. He is saying that even though many men see Quintia as stunning, he doesn’t share their opinion. He sees her as attractive: “tall and regal”. There is nothing exciting in the shape of her body. The description of Lesbia’s beauty is total; she has everything that Catullus wants to see in a woman. He says “ the sum of all other women are diminished”. She is the only one so beautiful and stunning and that there is no one who can surpass Lesbia’s beauty. According to his points of view, love is dependent on beauty.
2.

In poem 51, Catullus opens with the theme of his love to Lesbia. He sees his rival as a god because he can be next to Lesbia “That man, if it is right to say, seems to surpass the gods, who sitting opposite to you repeatedly looks at you and hears your sweet laughter…” In the lines of the poem, we can see jealousy toward that man who is with Lesbia. He describes himself as full of love for her even finding it difficult to talk to her. He clearly understands that all of that idleness will lead to nothing. I would say that this kind of love is social commentary which is valuable in modern time. Unrequited love continues to be very popular theme in literature.

Poem 76 shows the love Catullus has for Lesbia and how he tries to forget. He loves that woman but no longer wants her to love him back. He understands that she chooses not to be with him. He refers to his love as a disease and asks the gods to help him “I wish that I myself be healthy and put aside this horrible disease.” His voice is full of desperation and it is obvious that he is in a lot of pain because of unrequited love. In our time, the theme of unrequited love often appears in poems and songs which are actually quite popular because they capture people’s emotions which leads to a natural connection.

In poem 91, Catullus tells about Gellius being involved with the woman he loves. He is saying that he actually expected that behavior from him because Gellius loved games with any sins them. He takes pleasure in doing “the wrong thing” and as such he did it in spite of knowing of the love of his friend for that woman. The theme of morality in that poem shows what people are ready to do for their satisfaction. That topic is widely supported in our time by literature. Unfortunately people’s behavior remains the same: friends still betray each other.

3.

My personal definition of romantic love is the emotional and physical feelings that exist between people. That is a beautiful feeling that makes you desire them and causes their mere presence to influence great joy. You can’t measure it but rather you need to feel it in order to comprehend its profound nature and grasp.

“There is only one happiness in life: to love and be loved.”
~ by George Sand ~